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	<title>Comments on: Who Really Owns a Nonprofit?</title>
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	<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/</link>
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		<title>By: Randall</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-13288</link>
		<dc:creator>Randall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jan 2012 21:39:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-13288</guid>
		<description>Another question. Given the scope of an organization being limited to one county with population about 30,000, what would you recommend in terms of satisfying &quot;accountability&quot; to the public at large? Is Form 990 usually sufficient? As a matter of public relations, what more could be done to demonstrate to the public what they get for their dollar? Thanks for any help.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another question. Given the scope of an organization being limited to one county with population about 30,000, what would you recommend in terms of satisfying &#8220;accountability&#8221; to the public at large? Is Form 990 usually sufficient? As a matter of public relations, what more could be done to demonstrate to the public what they get for their dollar? Thanks for any help.</p>
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		<title>By: Randall</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-13167</link>
		<dc:creator>Randall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 28 Jan 2012 00:56:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-13167</guid>
		<description>Would there also be some legal concerns to allowing a &quot;proxy&quot; to assert substantial authority over the nonprofit? Seems like by failing to maintain an arms-length independent status could risk losing either corporate status or 501(c)(3) status. And might that proxy be held liable for actions of the nonprofit if there was de facto control by the proxy?

I&#039;ll look into that publication for more detail. I have some ideas how this ought to be resolved to the satisfaction of both parties but I&#039;d appreciate just an outline of what you feel would be reasonable. Bear in mind, the funder has legitimate concerns as to where the money is going. The corporation has concerns over someone effectively taking over the business.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Would there also be some legal concerns to allowing a &#8220;proxy&#8221; to assert substantial authority over the nonprofit? Seems like by failing to maintain an arms-length independent status could risk losing either corporate status or 501(c)(3) status. And might that proxy be held liable for actions of the nonprofit if there was de facto control by the proxy?</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll look into that publication for more detail. I have some ideas how this ought to be resolved to the satisfaction of both parties but I&#8217;d appreciate just an outline of what you feel would be reasonable. Bear in mind, the funder has legitimate concerns as to where the money is going. The corporation has concerns over someone effectively taking over the business.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg McRay</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-13157</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg McRay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jan 2012 23:08:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-13157</guid>
		<description>Your comments are dead-on, Randall.  Saying &quot;the taxpayers own it&quot; is a great turn-of-phrase, but it is essentially meaningless.  Local government doesn&#039;t own it, either.  If it exists as an IRS recognized, 501c3, charitable entity, then it is an independent corporation governed by a board of directors and accountable to the state under corporate law and to the federal government under IRC 501c3.  Any &quot;control&quot; ceded to another body or agency would have to be approved by the board in accordance with the bylaws.  Any such agreement should necessarily be contractual in nature and revokable by the board.  Reference IRS Publication 557 for all the nitty-gritty.

Sounds politically messy...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your comments are dead-on, Randall.  Saying &#8220;the taxpayers own it&#8221; is a great turn-of-phrase, but it is essentially meaningless.  Local government doesn&#8217;t own it, either.  If it exists as an IRS recognized, 501c3, charitable entity, then it is an independent corporation governed by a board of directors and accountable to the state under corporate law and to the federal government under IRC 501c3.  Any &#8220;control&#8221; ceded to another body or agency would have to be approved by the board in accordance with the bylaws.  Any such agreement should necessarily be contractual in nature and revokable by the board.  Reference IRS Publication 557 for all the nitty-gritty.</p>
<p>Sounds politically messy&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Randall</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-13148</link>
		<dc:creator>Randall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jan 2012 15:59:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-13148</guid>
		<description>There is a dispute between a local government and a volunteer fire department over the &quot;ownership&quot; issue. State law says nonprofits can&#039;t issue stock. Local government claims &quot;taxpayers&quot; own it. The board of directors claim they own it. I say they&#039;re both wrong and it seems you do, too.

The directors control and run the operation. Government provides funding for that operation for the public benefit. Unless that funding is &quot;earmarked&quot; - as in some government grants - it goes toward the general fund and applied within the discretion of the board and management. So long as they&#039;re meeting their general goals, they&#039;ve met their obligation as to application of funds.

While it plays to the public in a philosophical sense to claim taxpayers own it, it makes no sense at all in actual practice. Taxpayers fund many things over which they have no direct say.  An independent corporation of any description is just that. While the hand that feeds you implies a close relationship, there is still that dividing line over who controls what. In this case, a local politician wants to have a line-item veto over how funds are applied in day-to-day operations, claiming he can &quot;save the taxpayers money&quot;. In effect, he wants to manage the corporation. Naturally, the directors dispute his authority to that. I believe funding has been severly curtailed as a result.

Just like to hear your comments and perhaps get some reference to authoritative sources that might clarify the situation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a dispute between a local government and a volunteer fire department over the &#8220;ownership&#8221; issue. State law says nonprofits can&#8217;t issue stock. Local government claims &#8220;taxpayers&#8221; own it. The board of directors claim they own it. I say they&#8217;re both wrong and it seems you do, too.</p>
<p>The directors control and run the operation. Government provides funding for that operation for the public benefit. Unless that funding is &#8220;earmarked&#8221; &#8211; as in some government grants &#8211; it goes toward the general fund and applied within the discretion of the board and management. So long as they&#8217;re meeting their general goals, they&#8217;ve met their obligation as to application of funds.</p>
<p>While it plays to the public in a philosophical sense to claim taxpayers own it, it makes no sense at all in actual practice. Taxpayers fund many things over which they have no direct say.  An independent corporation of any description is just that. While the hand that feeds you implies a close relationship, there is still that dividing line over who controls what. In this case, a local politician wants to have a line-item veto over how funds are applied in day-to-day operations, claiming he can &#8220;save the taxpayers money&#8221;. In effect, he wants to manage the corporation. Naturally, the directors dispute his authority to that. I believe funding has been severly curtailed as a result.</p>
<p>Just like to hear your comments and perhaps get some reference to authoritative sources that might clarify the situation.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg McRay</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-13128</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg McRay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Jan 2012 05:31:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-13128</guid>
		<description>I agree that calling a VFD a public charity sounds a bit strange.  But, by technical definition, that is correct.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that calling a VFD a public charity sounds a bit strange.  But, by technical definition, that is correct.</p>
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		<title>By: Randall</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-13120</link>
		<dc:creator>Randall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Jan 2012 22:29:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-13120</guid>
		<description>Does a Volunteer Fire Department with 501(c)(3) designation and getting a majority of funding through a local government entity meet the definition of &quot;public charity&quot;? Or is another term more appropriate? Some claim to be a &quot;private&quot; organization but that is an ambiguous term. Any thoughts on that?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Does a Volunteer Fire Department with 501(c)(3) designation and getting a majority of funding through a local government entity meet the definition of &#8220;public charity&#8221;? Or is another term more appropriate? Some claim to be a &#8220;private&#8221; organization but that is an ambiguous term. Any thoughts on that?</p>
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		<title>By: Greg McRay, EA</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-960</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg McRay, EA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Dec 2010 01:59:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-960</guid>
		<description>Not a dumb question at all.  In fact, we answer similar questions almost daily.  Many nonprofits call themselves a &quot;foundation&quot; when in fact they are not...at least not technically.  In IRS terminology, a foundation is a specific type of 501c3 nonprofit, one that usually has no active programs.  True foundations typically raise money to fund the work of 501c3 &quot;charities&quot; that conduct actual programs.  And to further confuse the matter, a nonprofit corporation is the business entity type that most foundations and charities choose to adopt.  You will learn much more about how this all works once you get started with us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not a dumb question at all.  In fact, we answer similar questions almost daily.  Many nonprofits call themselves a &#8220;foundation&#8221; when in fact they are not&#8230;at least not technically.  In IRS terminology, a foundation is a specific type of 501c3 nonprofit, one that usually has no active programs.  True foundations typically raise money to fund the work of 501c3 &#8220;charities&#8221; that conduct actual programs.  And to further confuse the matter, a nonprofit corporation is the business entity type that most foundations and charities choose to adopt.  You will learn much more about how this all works once you get started with us.</p>
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		<title>By: J Hasten</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-959</link>
		<dc:creator>J Hasten</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Dec 2010 06:02:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-959</guid>
		<description>I am wondering what the difference is between a foundation and a non-profit corporation. I want to file for a non-profit and I will be calling ya&#039;ll for some help. I have some money that I would like to use to get started in a Ministry of Helps. I know this is probably a dumb question but I was just wondering the difference.
Thanks for your time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am wondering what the difference is between a foundation and a non-profit corporation. I want to file for a non-profit and I will be calling ya&#8217;ll for some help. I have some money that I would like to use to get started in a Ministry of Helps. I know this is probably a dumb question but I was just wondering the difference.<br />
Thanks for your time.</p>
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		<title>By: Ellis Carter</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-958</link>
		<dc:creator>Ellis Carter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Nov 2010 06:39:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-958</guid>
		<description>Nice post. This is a poorly understood concept that really needs more attention. Thanks for highlighting it. Have also blogged about this topic at http://bit.ly/a377mo</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice post. This is a poorly understood concept that really needs more attention. Thanks for highlighting it. Have also blogged about this topic at <a href="http://bit.ly/a377mo" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/a377mo</a></p>
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		<title>By: Greg McRay, EA</title>
		<link>http://www.501c3.org/blog/who-really-owns-a-nonprofit/#comment-957</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg McRay, EA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Mar 2010 02:18:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.501c3.org/blog/?p=897#comment-957</guid>
		<description>n all candor, there is no way to answer a question of this complexity in a few sentences.  I highly recommend that you contact us and reserve some consulting time to discuss your plans.  You have way too much at stake.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>n all candor, there is no way to answer a question of this complexity in a few sentences.  I highly recommend that you contact us and reserve some consulting time to discuss your plans.  You have way too much at stake.</p>
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